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Maruti A-Star Test Drive Report

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and this isnt about campaigning about ones favorite car or favorite company..I am attacking the very logic that goes behind buying or suggesting or evaluating a car..

If tomorrow someone posts a query saying that he/she wants a sporty looking car for a family of 2-3,with emphasis on outright performance, handling, the getz should be last on his/her list..that person should buy the swift..

it is important to understand that one car cant meet every requirement...the swift has many shortcomings, as does the getz or the uva

and please dont rely solely on magazine ratings..they can be misleading..

for eg...the linea was just given 9/10...but that rating does not take into consideration fiat's after sales, dealer network...

similarly, when the swift was rated 9/10, the ACI guys probably did not realise the poor build quality as those cars generally have very few kms on the clock..

subsequent long term tests revealed it all..

and no one should trust a company blindly...its the worst thing that one can do.

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Valid point, actually I apply this logic conciously/subconciously in every suggestion I make, I have suggested cars across the board to prospective buyers keeping in mind their requirements.

Getz/UVA never made it big in the market due to thier own reasons, if customers can make  little adjustments in their requirements, better cars can be theirs. Don't forget Swift is an absolute looker, apart from other talents, I have suggested i10 to plenty.

We take cues from magazine ratings as they test cars extensively & have better/more knowledge, but we correlate both customers wants & mags tips & come up with suitable solutions.

Please also keep in mind that build quality is not the top priority in all the minds, total package is more appealing.

Over the years I have owned/used cars across the board & many Marutis too & I have been satisfied with my Marutis more so than many others.

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@ speed

I have been a loyal ACI reader since its first issue that featured a ford IKON..

the poor resale value is becoz of the perceived opinion of the getz..it didnt get what it deserved.

and i would like you to please read my post again...i never singled out anyone's comment as crap...i was targeting the very notion of it being overpriced..not anyone's comments.

even i keep learning newer things abt cars evryday..it isnt going to stop till the day i die.

and i do not think we are representative of a larger audience...

i believe you are a palio owner..correct me if i am wrong..there are many other palio owners too..the larger uninformed consumer base considered the palio as a bad car, which was far from the truth..the palio was a great car, but sadly marketed by fools..you yourself bought the car, without bothering about what anyone else felt...doesnt that say volumes about how differently we think as opposed to others..there are also spark owners, getz owners, safari owners amongst us.these are perceived as cars that are not "good enough"..but we still bought them because they suited our needs the best...

till now i have never rubbished a car outrightly and without a good reason, i have only outlined the true and obvious faults with it and suggested them accordingly.you only have to read my previous posts if you dont believe me..

if i have hurt anyones sentiments by my comments, i would like to issue an apology for it...it may have been an emotional outburst..

but everyone else also has to think twice when they call a car a "disaster" or a "debacle" or "useless"...I have never used such words ever in any of my posts....it deeply hurts owners like me too, especially when i have owned such a car and been so happy with it..i am here to tell you that its a good car and worth buying..i feel very sad with the way people rubbish cars like the getz, palio etc  just becoz they dont sell

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According to me, forums are reflective! Afterall we are people from the society itself & no different.

I know everything about Palio, I've always maintained its a good car, but destroyed by Fiat, but see consumers are going to see the total package & not just the good car, so really suggesting Palio to everyone doesn't make sense. Yes, I bought it going against the popular notion & must say repented bigtime!

We have to tell the true/total story to prospective buyers & why not also tell them that a car is a failure due to certain reasons & then leave it to him to decide.

We stay/live on the forum almost 24/7 & this  forum for us is like 2nd. home, so any outbursts/attacks/foul language hurts, as we like living peacefully/with love & enjoy our time.

A failure is a failure like black is black & white is white! Why run from the facts, we have to tell prospective consumers the true picture, if a car has failed in the market due to whatever reasons, but it has failed, why keep somebody in blind? Even I own certain cars, but ridicule them at the first instance whenever I feel it is right/needed, even FRG does that & really respect this virtue. Also, I never mind if someone says bad but true words about the cars I own, you can check many threads, Ive myself ridiculed my own cars where necessary. My posts on Corolla/Palio/Gypsy/Cielo/Astra/etc. are a testament to this. But as you are new on the forum, probably you don't know much that has happened in the past!

What we own or choose, doesn't mean is the best!! 

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 the indian consumer base is largely uneducated about cars..

 

i dont care about other markets either' date=' but am very disappointed about how "popular opinion" destroys otherwise very good cars in india..
[/quote']

 

very well said, thisisviraj, and if we want further proof of how majorities make the worst decisions, look at the people we vote into power smiley36.gif

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A failure is a failure like black is black & white is white! Why run from the facts' date=' we have to tell prospective consumers the true picture, if a car has failed in the market due to whatever reasons, but it has failed, why keep somebody in blind? Even I own certain cars, but ridicule them at the first instance whenever I feel it is right/needed, even FRG does that & really respect this virtue. Also, I never mind if someone says bad but true words about the cars I own, you can check many threads, Ive myself ridiculed my own cars where necessary. My posts on Corolla/Palio/Gypsy/Cielo/Astra/etc. are a testament to this. But as you are new on the forum, probably you don't know much that has happened in the past!

What we own or choose, doesn't mean is the best!! 
[/quote']

this is precisely what i am trying to convey....its not all black and white...the getz paled in comparison to the swift becoz of its price, unsporty performance and handling..but that doesnt make it a bad car, does it..there is a flipside to all those downsides.those are; vastly better quality, comfortable ride and cabin space and great driveability..ordinary car buying public which drives in the city dont really care much about performance or razor sharp handling or even looks, sometimes..the getz virtues were conveniently buried under all this..and i find that unfair..we, as an informed members shud know better than to disregard these virtues

i own an MS product too..an SX4 since june 16 2007..and am not exactly thrilled about it either..everytime i hear that doorpad or glovebox rattle over the smallest of pothole, i cringe...i cringe at the thot of having spent 8 lakhs for a car that feels like its 10 yrs old already..id rather have bought the verna..

subsequently i hav rarely suggested the sx4 to neone, unless the car really fits the buyer profile.

none of us make the right decisions about cars..

thats why it is so important to not just say that a car is a failure altogether..it is equally important to highlight the reasons why it has failed..if people are informed about the reasons for the failure of cars like the getz, u-va...they would think twice before investing their money blindly.

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You are going into deep reasoning, any argument is not going to make failure a success! Everthing has reasons, its like a guy failing in a class also has his own reasons, those reasons don't make him pass!

Ford Mondeo/Fusion were also good cars, but failed because were not suitable for our market. It is not because of illeterate customers as Mondeo's customers were wealthy/educated.

Price is a big deciding factor in Indian buyers mind, so anything overpriced is deemed to fail, so the Getz too, it also had lower FE than Swift.

In your view maybe Getz is a supercar, but the truth is that its just a normal car beaten hollow by the Swift & that's it.

Where is the reasoning, I have suggested Getz to many  on the forum to whom FE/finance/resale/etc. is not an issue.

Let alone a failue, you are hell bent on demeaning successful products, I would suggest you to first get accustomed to Indian market dynamics as we are dealing here & not in UK/USA.

I never said Getz is a bad car, but it failed as a car due to its own reasons & people do not want to be seen in/buying failed products, its so simple. Hyundai might just stop its production due to lack of sales & even you can witness its further fall in resale value.

Its my choice whatever cars I suggest, how can someone tell me what to suggest or not, or ridicule someones views. You are free to express your will but it ends there, Im not going to change the way I think, failure to me is a failure nomatter what happens.

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you feel very strongly about ridiculing someone's comments...what do you think you are doing to me now?

you have twisted and exaggerated each of my comments completely out of context to suit ur own purpose..

for eg i never cald the getz a supercar...those are your words not mine..in fact i think its a very simple car.

i am tired of trying to make my point heard to people who are not open to new reasoning....i think i too will end it here..

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I have noticed a very peculiar thing for sometime now, it can now be even taken as a mini survey as the control group has been forum members. The owners of peripheral cars/cars which did not sell well/ relative failures, are very sensitive lot & try hard to justify their purchase most of the time & do not take -ve  comments about their possetions in a sporting manner.

Good cars/required by our market, have done well & their adoption/ acceptance proves that. Also companies launch models with the sole purpose to propell their product to the top & achieve best sales figures. Consumers also want/go in for successful models rather than end up winding dead snakes around their necks. The models which fail/do not sell well, lack something  the consumers want/aspire for & this is across the board with any manufacturer. Eg. of failed/unsuccessful models by diff. manufacturers:

Maruti- Versa, Vitara, Baleno.

Ford- Fusion, Mondeo

GM- Aveo, UVA, Corsa

Hyundai- Elantra, terracan, tuscon, Sonata, Getz

Mitsubishi- Pajero

Fiat-Petra

These are just some egs. Now these cars are not bad per say, but failed/did not do well because of various reasons. Few Customers did buy them for thier own reasons, but majority of them shied/kept away. So ideally we do not suggest these models generally unless requirement demands so or if a consumer personally likes them.

But these consumers later on do not take the shortcomings of their cars in a sporting manner,  every car has shortcomings, but some have more/profound than others.

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when a car is deemed as a failure for all the wrong reasons, its difficult to digest...i can take -ve comments like lower FE and uninspiring handling..thats coz they are  true..as for the rest, no one seems to get the bigger picture and no one wants to look beyond whats obvious..

the palio couldnt succeed in the market bcoz of poor a.s.s and uninterested dealers..now that is a valid reason..it also had low FE but the other virtues of the car more than made up for it..

am not trying to justify my purchase..had i been genuinely unhappy with the car, i would have sold it long ago..if i cant be truthful to myself, i cant suggest others what to buy either...

I also have noticed a very peculiar thing in this forum, the sincere opinion of owners of fringe cars are dismissed, pooh-poohed and crushed with impunity. the minorities are pushed into a corner and if they dont agree with the popular opinion, they are made to feel as outcasts...whats so sporting about that?

my friends, it works both ways..if what is being said is genuine, it should be at least acknowledged, doesnt matter how weak or insignificant the voice is..and if there is any truth in what is said, it should be accepted..

i am terribly disillusioned and feel totally marginalised.

all becoz i own and like a 'dead snake'.

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I have always maintained, failure is a failure, whatever the reasons, how can you or anybody say, those are right or wrong! Let me cite a few reasons why Getz could not do well, as do not seem to know the whole story:

-High priced Hyundai(Korean)

-Average looks

-Low FE

-Average handling

-slow pick up.

-& some more which I have forgotten over time, as there was nothing worth remembering too!

For now Getz is on the verge of extinction as Hyundai might just discontinue it due to lack of demand.

Good that you can be happy with these shortcomings, majority can't! So, Im not saying you bought a bad car, but just that the car you bought has certain shortcomings due to which people opted for others.

 

Also, don't try to lay baseless claims about the forum, you are so new to have even noticed the pulse of the forum, stay on for a while, get to know stuff, then you shall be able to comment in this aspect.

You are the one who started to dismiss/crush others opinions as crap! Atttempts to educate you turned to deaf ears. I always said that Getz was a good car to begin with but now its time has passed, so suggesting it to new buyers is not the best thing to do, unless its the only car one can buy, competition has moved on my friend & so has the market!

You don't need anybodys rating to enjoy your car! Keep enjoying your favourite buy, we are happy too!

Word of advise- let others suggest to the best to their knowledge & you suggest to yours, without crossing ways, as that's certainly not required. Also, respect everyones views, this shall help you get re-illusioned & joining the mainstream, if you wish!

 

 

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my first car was an 800 and I have an alto vx 1.1 as well

maruti suzuki first entered this country in partnership with the gandhi govt and quickly realised how much money they could make from a starved socialist society. in my opinion' date=' it is this company that is single handedly responsible for high prices and protectionist policies that this market suffers from. let's not forget that with a 15 year head start, suzuki have fully depreciated plants in this country and cost advantages that no other manufacturer can claim - thanks to a corrupt govt.

the figures speak for themselves - suzuki sells 20% of all global produce in India alone - which account for 60% of all global profit. in effect, suzuki make 3 times the profit on every Indian sale as compared to any other market.

are they thieves? absolutely. do they sell. absolutely. why do they sell? first mover advantage, ubiquitious sales and service, and many decades of building a false brand security. Indians are also obsessed with perceived value and not actual value - so if a car looks good, they think it gives them 'status' (hence the bizarre desire to buy cars with boots as status symbols, the higher sales of the Swift with an old Esteem engine - sold only in this market - over the Getz, and also why companies like Honda and Maruti sell us sports variants with no engine mods whatsoever, but lots of pretentious styling).

so yes, we are an immature market. in fairness to speed and other forum members tho, Maruti does what all other manufacturers in this county do - cheat customers whenever and however they can.

they're all the same.
[/quote']

 

Bull's eye! exactly my point.

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I have always maintained' date=' failure is a failure, whatever the reasons, how can you or anybody say, those are right or wrong! Let me cite a few reasons why Getz could not do well, as do not seem to know the whole story:

-High priced Hyundai(Korean)

-Average looks

-Low FE

-Average handling

-slow pick up.

-& some more which I have forgotten over time, as there was nothing worth remembering too!

For now Getz is on the verge of extinction as Hyundai might just discontinue it due to lack of demand.

Good that you can be happy with these shortcomings, majority can't! So, Im not saying you bought a bad car, but just that the car you bought has certain shortcomings due to which people opted for others.

 

Also, don't try to lay baseless claims about the forum, you are so new to have even noticed the pulse of the forum, stay on for a while, get to know stuff, then you shall be able to comment in this aspect.

You are the one who started to dismiss/crush others opinions as crap! Atttempts to educate you turned to deaf ears. I always said that Getz was a good car to begin with but now its time has passed, so suggesting it to new buyers is not the best thing to do, unless its the only car one can buy, competition has moved on my friend & so has the market!

You don't need anybodys rating to enjoy your car! Keep enjoying your favourite buy, we are happy too!

Word of advise- let others suggest to the best to their knowledge & you suggest to yours, without crossing ways, as that's certainly not required. Also, respect everyones views, this shall help you get re-illusioned & joining the mainstream, if you wish!

 

 
[/quote']

 

Speed - you dont seem to understand the point or pretend that you didnt.

we are not referring to comparison of any particular model, even if you want to compare, Getz was sold in high numbers internationally, the number Swift cant even dream of.

i feel responsible to educate and help my fellow country men to change the mindset towards MS, which MS has managed to create from the past 15 years, i feel its time we look into other brands and manufacturers who can provide better quality and service at a cheaper price.

we are not saying, Indians are fools that MS lived happily for a long time, its early entrance and political support had been useful for MS and sometimes ppl tend to make decisions on the emotional level, which has been continuing for a long time so atleast now this has to be changed FOR GOOD.

If you continue to say that Maruti has sold good numbers in India and service has been the best, resale has been the best - we know all these facts and accept but now we are attempting to make the change which has to change the auto scene in India and we are interested in seeing our market to become as matured as any other developing/developed nation!
harryccc2008-12-08 10:59:21

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That's the whole point Harry, you did not understand me! All Im saying is that forget International data, that's irrelevant by our standards.Many highly internationally rated cars bunked here & not without a reason.

Why only change mindset against MS, all are sailing in the same boat. Even other brands are selling well now, where is the need for false propoganda? No other brand as of now is offering better service than Maruti, just see the shear no. of outlets for instance, they are all for customer satisfaction.

Whatever aid/support MS got was its fate,  it did a lot to capatalise on its good fortunes & did not just go of to sleep!

What change are you reffering to ? To better or to worse?? Maruti has set certain standards for others to follow & emulate.

Its our own mindsets that need change rather than others! Let the market grow & learn on its own, its going in the right direction. World's eyes are on india now & you are asking to copy developed World!! Rise up man, India doesn't need to follow anything, set your own standards for others to follow, young India!! 

Developed markets had their 6-12 Cyl. cars, big SUV's, GAS guzzlers & a nuclear has fallen on them now. They have woken up to the fact that only Efficient cars can save the planet & are looking to the developing World to supply them the material, now which market do you think is Mature?

 

If Maruti is providing everything, what change are you reffering too!!! Wake up man!!
speed2008-12-08 11:24:18

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That's the whole point Harry' date=' you did not understand me! All Im saying is that forget International data, that's irrelevant by our standards.Many highly internationally rated cars bunked here & not without a reason.

Why only change mindset against MS, all are sailing in the same boat. Even other brands are selling well now, where is the need for false propoganda? No other brand as of now is offering better service than Maruti, just see the shear no. of outlets for instance, they are all for customer satisfaction.

Whatever aid/support MS got was its fate,  it did a lot to capatalise on its good fortunes & did not just go of to sleep!

What change are you reffering to ? To better or to worse?? Maruti has set certain standards for others to follow & emulate.

Its our own mindsets that need change rather than others! Let the market grow & learn on its own, its going in the right direction. World's eyes are on india now & you are asking to copy developed World!! Rise up man, India doesn't need to follow anything, set your own standards for others to follow, young India!! 

Developed markets had their 6-12 Cyl. cars, big SUV's, GAS guzzlers & a nuclear has fallen on them now. They have woken up to the fact that only Efficient cars can save the planet & are looking to the developing World to supply them the material, now which market do you think is Mature?

 

If Maruti is providing everything, what change are you reffering too!!! Wake up man!!
[/quote']

 

there have been a lot of answers to all your questions here! i guess you may have to read others posts carefully before you post anything buddy!

this shows who has to wake up or you may wanna try to find something new to type and post!

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ENOUGH of this nonsense. Your words have brought shame to this forum and hence all the posts which had no business being here have been deleted.

 

Let me make it very clear to everyone that these kinds of posts will not be accepted and tolerated here. Hence I would like to Publickily announce that both of you have been Banned. YOu ban will be lifted on the 21st of December.

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I hope this sets an example for anyone who thinks he can take this forum for granted.

 

@Speed & Harryccc, You may resume posting from 21st of December.

 

@Harry, repeat this behaviour and you shall never be allowed on this forum again. I hope I make my point clear.

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this guy harrycc shouldnt be allowed to post in the forum...i mean look at his language ...this is a forum and here we only indulge into discussions.

i standby speed as viraj,me and speed were having a healthy debate and harry started using abysmal language.

speed is not at fault....cyrus please lift the ban on him.

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cyrus i think that ban is quite long for speed

for harry it is understandable but not for speed!!

i had also been reading the debate and i was learning some things but when harry came in....

anyways let's get back to topic about a star!!

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@mehul and archit. I understand your concern, but as both of them blatantly used abusive and undesirable language, i think it is fair to give them bot an equal punishment. Can we please proceed with what this thread is supposed to be for.

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@cyrus43

I joined this forum becoz i have been an ACI reader ever since the magazine was introduced in the market...I wanted to be a member of a like minded group of people which evaluates cars not by popular opinion or sales figures but by what they have to offer and by how well they do the job they were set out to do. I can understand ordinary laymen getting swayed by 0-60 figures, claims of razor sharp handling, funky looks..But none of these aspects really matter out on the road..when was the last time any one of us did a smoking start from the signal, or chucked the car onto a crowded street to test the limits of the car's handling capabilities...yet we have always yearned for that punch from the engine while in 3rd gear doing 30-40 kph, that cushy comfortable ride while going over India's cratered streets, for that extra bit of space..But then, these aspects are so very boring to think about and are subsequently overshadowed..A mileage figure lower than the competitor's by 0.5 kpl is labelled as poor.when manufacturers do their bit to ensure global quality standards in their cars and as a result end up pricing their cars higher than others, why are they termed overpriced? I will make a direct reference to MSL..why is there such a massive gulf in overall build quality, fit and finish between cars made for india as against those made for europe and other regions..Dont we deserve the same? I have owned an SX4 for more than a year..so i know what i am talking about..whenever i have raised this issue in the forum, i have been severely criticized...

i expected this to be a group that enlightens the majority consumer base, largely un(mis?)informed, about cars..it seems to be the other way round here..ive seen too many people,friends, relatives make wrong choices about cars..they've ended up buying cars that have gone completely against their priorites and requirements...all coz of popular opinion..

ive seen a friend buy a popular c-segment hatch for his family of five(including grandparents) and then regretting it after 2 yrs...

Ive seen my dad's collegue buy a popular petrol mid size car..he drives about 22000k a year and is now cribbing about fuel bills..all coz of the need to do what everyone else does..

I have also seen the use of words like "disaster", "useless" being attributed to cars that dont sell well enough..these arent the words of a car lover..its akin to kicking an old dog..I fail to see the fun in it or the reason for it.

I realise you are the moderator of the forum..my argument is not with you at all..i just wanted to make myself heard, thats all..

I am assuming that you read just the last few posts in this thread, those by speed and harryccc and decided to ban them for a while..had you read the posts on the prev page, you would have noticed my involvement in this argument..I guess i am equally at fault.

I have a simple request. I tried to find a way to delete my account on my own but couldnt do it..I would like you to do the needful..I no longer wish to be an active member

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hey viraj we are just having a discussion and you shouldnt be cribbing just because majority dont agree with you....on this forum one gets every kind of advice....if you end up on a loosing side in a debate rather than brooding you should take it in a sporting manner. but bottomlime maruti suzuki is the best and better than hyundai.

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